Atheist Bus Campaign determined to roll on despite set back
23.02.10 | simon | 
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Example ad image from the UK Campaign (thanks Jon Worth)
The NZ Atheist Bus Campaign, which late last year raised in excess of $20,000 from public donations, has met a set back in their plans. Nationwide bus company NZ Bus, who had tentatively approved the campaign’s ads on buses in major city centres, have now rejected them.
NZ Bus stated that they have received a number of complaints from the public about the proposed ads, which read “There’s probably no god. Now stop worrying and enjoy your life.”
Spokesperson for the Atheist Bus Campaign Simon Fisher says “It’s concerning that peaceful atheist messages are not allowed on buses while religious messages are often seen on buses and in public. Messages of atheism are rare in New Zealand and we aim to raise awareness for the one-third of New Zealanders who are unconvinced by the claims of religion.”
Organisers of the Campaign tried to reach a resolution with NZ Bus, and later attempted mediation sessions through the Human Rights Commission. NZ Bus refused to participate in these mediation sessions. Because they are refusing to discuss the matter and reach an agreement, the organisers of the Campaign are now investigating the possibility of taking this case to the Human Rights Review Tribunal.
Simon Fisher says “we’re disappointed at the response from NZ Bus and plan to look at options going forward. We owe it to the thousands of Kiwis who have supported this campaign with donations and messages of support.”
Advertisements with identical wording ran in the United Kingdom, Canada, Germany, and Spain. Similar campaigns also ran successfully in Croatia, Finland, Holland, Italy, America and across the Tasman in Australia.
“We are gravely concerned that in New Zealand we’re unable to present an atheistic message, showing that we do not have the same practical freedom of expression as in other first world countries. It highlights why this campaign is so necessary.” said spokesperson Simon Fisher.
The Campaign will continue to accept donations for advertising, see http://www.nogod.org.nz for further details.
February 24th, 2010 at 12:20 am
Here’s the link to the online complaints Human Rights Commission
http://www.hrc.co.nz/home/hrc/enquiriescomplaints/onlinecomplaintsform.php
I’m not going to rest until this campaign gets a fair chance to run.
Good luck everyone on your avenues of complaint.
February 24th, 2010 at 12:42 am
Dear NZ Atheists,
As a practising Christian, working for a church in London, England, I think it’s a crying shame that you’ve not been allowed the privilege of having this advert put on buses. I quite like the adverts – they provoke debate, make people think, and stir them from their apathy.
You’ve got my support, and I wish you all the best.
Oh, and please ignore the Christians who come on here looking for a fight. We can be a very narrow-minded bunch. Forgive us our indelicacies, please!
Thanks, and God bless,
David
February 24th, 2010 at 12:56 am
Disappointed by this. Whilst I don’t support your campaign, I certainly support your right to express your opinion. Even if it is “just another case of someone pushing their belief or religion onto others”
.
February 24th, 2010 at 3:20 am
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February 24th, 2010 at 7:16 am
You guys are all crazy, God Bless Jesus!!! FOREVER, and the lord, and the Holy Ghost!!
February 24th, 2010 at 9:29 am
David Marriott:
Thanks David – I appreciate the gesture.
February 24th, 2010 at 10:16 am
My email to NZ Bus below. Will also try calling the phone number given above for their media person.
“Please add my name to those appalled at your reported stance not to allow the atheist bus adverts on your buses. It appears that you are happy with Christian messages but not atheist messages. This seems a very strange and unjustifiable stance considering the current makeup of New Zealand society.
Are you aware that in the 2006 census, some 35% of New Zealanders declared that they had no religion or were atheists? The figure for Christians in the same census was a fraction over 50%. Not only that but the “no religion figure” has been increasing by 5% from each of the previous two censuses (25% in 1996, 30% in 2001) and Christianity has been decreasing by exactly the same amount (60% in 1996, 55% in 2001). If this trend continues, then the gap will narrow in 2011, and in the 2016 census we are likely to see those of no religion outnumber Christians in New Zealand.
So atheists are hardly a minority group now, and likely to be the majority in six years time. So why do you feel it is acceptable to “offend” one large segment of the community but not another? And when you look at what the advert says, how can you actually describe it as offensive? It’s simply a statement of the beliefs of a very large segment of the population. Nothing more threatening than that.”
February 24th, 2010 at 10:31 am
Right, I’ve just phoned Siobhan O’Donovan, Communications Manager on 021 840 839 as recommended above. I was very careful to keep my voice polite at all times and simply asked if she could give NZ Bus’s reasons for rejecting the advertising.
She said first that she was the “media” person and only normally spoke to media orgaisations. But she gave me a couple of minutes. She said the reason for rejecting the advertisement was that following the publicity last year they had received calls from a number or outside people and their own staff disturbed at the adverts and so had decided not to show them “to avoid controversy’.
When I tried to ask her a further question she said she was not going to say any more. She spoke politely but over the top of me and hung up the phone as I was asking her if she would remove Christian advertising if enough atheist objected to it.
I infer that their decision is causing them embarrassment. So I suggest we keep up the pressure and I am another who would be happy to use some of the funds raised to pursue them via the Human Rights Commission.
Go Voltaire.
February 24th, 2010 at 10:37 am
I noticed yesterday that NZBus don’t cover Christchurch and that Christchurch is on the list of cities.
Are the buses still running in Christchurch?
February 24th, 2010 at 10:44 am
Add me to the list who are happy for my donation to be used to pursue this through the HRC.
February 24th, 2010 at 11:17 am
I’ve just placed a complaint through the HRC too.
February 24th, 2010 at 11:36 am
David Stott
Nice work on the phone call.
You have to love the irony behind the situation NZBus has gotten itself into.
Would there have been a bit of controversy had they just run the ads? Of course – but all they really had to do was trot out the stock standard:
The views expressed in the ads contracted by NZBus do not necessarily reflect the views of NZBus or their staff.
Or something to similar effect that pleases the lawyers.
It will probably turn out that discriminating against a grass-roots interest group on religious grounds will turn out to be far, far more controversial than if they’d just run the ads in the first place.
February 24th, 2010 at 12:13 pm
I cannot believe they would do a thing like this! I’m furious. Will definitely be emailing them and avoiding using them – and urging others to do the same.
February 24th, 2010 at 12:13 pm
As a Christian who works in a Christian organisation and serves as a licensed Minister in the Wesleyan Methodist Church of New Zealand, I am disappointed that NZ Bus have decided not to run with the campaign due to complaints from the public.
I believe in God. I believe in the birth, death and resurrection of Jesus of Nazareth and I do my utmost to live according to the principles and values that seemed to be central to the life Jesus lived.
I also uphold democracy and freedom of speech as great tools of a healthy and functioning society. Where it does not cause violent actions to be committed against a person or group, all citizens should be free to express their opinions and to use public forums such as advertising space to do so.
The inherent ability within a democracy for groups who differ to share their opinions and critique one another is necessary for our ability to live and function alongside each other in a way that encourages empathy and community. When that gets stifled we only encourage and feed division.
This campaign encourages discussion and gives people a way in which they can express their views – it’s a conversation starter. If it acts as a spark that encourages people to be honest about their views (either way) without feeling the need to shy away, then great.
My hope is that somehow it will still go ahead.
February 24th, 2010 at 12:31 pm
I’ve also contacted the Human Rights Commission – they are not getting away with this!
February 24th, 2010 at 1:10 pm
[...] of support and raised the funds necessary to get the messages of the side of buses… but now NZ Bus has backed out of running with the campaign due to complaints from the [...]
February 24th, 2010 at 1:49 pm
Disgraceful! This is the sort of nonsense you expect in the US, but they’ve already HAD the ads on their buses. I would encourage people to make their thoughts known to NZ Bus. Keep it clean and constructive, people!
February 24th, 2010 at 3:04 pm
I just sent them a polite email.
I think if they are justifying their refusal on grounds of the complaints they received earlier, then they are vulnerable to an argument based on the number of complaints generated by their refusal.
February 24th, 2010 at 3:05 pm
Can we donate money towards funding legal action if there is any human rights legislation that NZ Bus may have breached?
This sort of behaviour is more in line with what I’d expect in Saudi Arabia, not New Zealand
February 24th, 2010 at 3:29 pm
Ive sent my email to NZ bus company as well. They wanted to avoid controvery, but now have more on their hands. I agrueed that it was an infringement on human rights, freedom of speech and is similar to discrimination based on belief. I pointed out that any atheist who would complain about a christian ad would be labeled a discriminator and their opinion would become void.
This is soooo unfair, i will follow this issue.
Id like to point out that for each atheist who has heard of this issue, more haven’t. Publicity and pressure are most important to get a change to occur.
February 24th, 2010 at 5:12 pm
NZ Bus have removed their corporate office phone number from their website. I happen to know that it is 04 802 4100. I’ll be ringing to complain in the morning, as well as sending an email.
February 24th, 2010 at 5:48 pm
Just go through many smaller bus advertising companies. Palmerston North, beind a student city, would more than likely be a good climate for this kind of sentiment. The guy I talked to at the advertising company wasn’t adverse to the Atheist bus ads at all.
I don’t begrudge the NZBus company. If they alienated Christians, they’d probably be losing a lot of business and it really is their choice whether they run ads on their buses.
We can be all airy fairy about this and go down the Human Rights Tribunal avenue, taking far too long to come to a conclusion, or we can say, “Whatever, we’re doing this any way” and run billboards and ads with bus companies who won’t sway to public opinion.
February 24th, 2010 at 6:17 pm
I myself, a Christian, believe that you guys should have the same freedom of expression through an ad that a Christian does, but you have to realize that the reason they’re doing this is because of money. They are worried that if they do something the public disagrees with they will lose business, so they are going to try to stay on the public’s good side.
February 24th, 2010 at 7:19 pm
Here’s an idea:
make large bumper-sticker sized versions of the ad for distribution.
There are a number of us who support your efforts in Wellington that would be more than happy to slap these on every bus and stop in town!
February 24th, 2010 at 7:21 pm
I don’t begrudge the NZBus company.
I do. since when have they EVER cared about customer complaints before now?
I surely smell a rat… a fundy rat on the admin at NZ Bus.
I will bet money if you keep pushing, it will surface.
February 24th, 2010 at 10:27 pm
Ichthyic
No.
The idea does make me smile. But joking aside, that would be a bad idea to act on. Defacing public property is the kind of thing we’re supposed to be better than.
And you just know someone somewhere is going to quote-mine this website at some point and come out crowing with any little thing they can pick out of context.
We’re trying to win points in this campaign, not lose them.
Better not to give them any free ammunition, yes?
February 24th, 2010 at 11:25 pm
Opinion piece here: http://nzagainstthecurrent.blogspot.com/2010/02/not-on-buses.html
February 25th, 2010 at 1:19 am
Evan (Item 15), In regard to yr atheism, excuse me, but what is (quote) “a probable fact”?…other than just ‘a possibility’, no more, no less, ie an unreliable aspect, about which there can be…NO SURETY.
And Daniel Schealler (Item 17), Granting atheists the same courtesy of ideas promalgation as agnostics or believers, is akin to advocating homosexuality as another viable and proper optional model for humankind, in the face of the procreational heterosexual model…or of ‘other family models’, in the face of the evolutionary 2-parent family…or abortion as a viable normal option, in the face of the sovereign right to life of every living being that’s life has commenced.
And Stefan (Item 21), I trained as an architect, hold an honours degree and have run a practice since 1979, so I think I can claim some small comprehension of the significance of DESIGN. And be in no doubt, design is what we see all about us (and awesome majesty & beauty to boot), not accidental tragedies & failed attempts. The grandeur & vastness of the cosmos, in the elegance of the minutest particles of physics, in the diversity & beauty of Earth’s Nature, in the awesome power of the forces that fluidly swirl, yet hold it all in such fine balance…..yet gradually, not too qickly, not too slowly, evolves a process…which is CREATION IN THE DOING. An unfolding of the future in time, through motion in matter and in spirit. All this, under the very noses of those who would deny a Grand Design, sadly because they have swallowed the Creation-in-a-Blink theory just as heartily as fundamentalists, albeit to reject.
February 25th, 2010 at 2:33 am
Agree with Judi (2nd comment)
e-mail info {at} nzbus.co(.)nz to let them know how stupid they look
February 25th, 2010 at 9:33 am
I don’t at all agree with the actions of NZ Bus, but I can guess how it probably came to be in this state. (And this is a guess.) Complaints from the public might have had something to do with it, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the requests of its staff had at least as much to do with it.
NZBus is a company that’s had recent and ongoing bad relations with employee unions, including major bus driver strikes or lock-outs (depending on your point of view) as recently as 5 months ago which would have been a nightmare to manage. It’s also had pressure from the other side with people and politicians complaining about perpetually increasing fares and bad service.
If some drivers threatened to cause more trouble rather than drive a bus that advertised something they so fundamentally disagreed with, it would probably explain why the NZBus management got touchy and tried and walk a tight-rope between staff concerns and human rights laws, and hoped the whole thing would just simmer away and be forgotten. Doing so must have been unrealistically optimistic as they might now be thinking.
None of this is an excuse for management or policies that would have led to the whole situation in the first place. Personally I wonder if the problems go much deeper than its responses to a few complaints about advertising.